If there is a worse way for a professional sport to handle distribution of tickets I’m sure the NHL will be the first ones to adopt it. The Winter Classic game could be about the garnering of new fans, but instead the NHL is distancing itself from the fan base it already has.
I’m going to start with Season Ticket Holders.I will give this to the NHL, this year is better than the first year the NHL held the Winter Classic when the NHL allotted the Penguins season ticket holders 1500 tickets. They still haven’t figured it out. This game is a regular season game. Though it’s not considered a home game for the Pittsburgh Penguins, it is in our city. Season Ticket Holders of the home team, in this case the Washington Capitals (long story), should have been awarded first choice out of all the seats, then Season Ticket Holders (from here on out referred to as STH’s) of the away team.
Instead the NHL distributed tickets to STH’s according to where they sit in their arena. Once again screwing their most devoted fan base. Most STH’s of the upper bowls of both the Capitals and Penguins arena’s got tickets in the very upper bowl of Heinz Field behind non season ticket holders. What did many Penguins fans who hold season tickets and support their team all year long get for their team devotion? The upper bowl end zone seats, yes the frozen bleacher benches in the end zone of Heinz Field or as we call it here on PenguinPoop.com, “the Shaft”. Yes, they got “the Shaft”
Then a week ago on December 14th the Penguins announced to STH’s that they had more tickets available for sale at 10am and placed their usually no where near enough people manning their phones, most likely 2 people, to field thousands of calls. With no announcement of when they were sold out, just a busy signal all day.
Then there are the Pittsburgh Steeler seat license holders were offered 3000 to 5000 tickets in a lottery, the real number is unknown, but many of those fans are unhappy because with the purchase of their seat licenses for thousands of dollars they were supposed to receive first right of refusal for any and all events at Heinz Field.
The NHL is claiming to have given the Penguins 30,000 tickets, the Capitals 20,000 tickets, the Steelers 3000 to 5000 tickets and are distributing 10,000 tickets themselves.
For the rest of the supposed 10,000 tickets, the NHL held a lottery. On the NHL’s website you had to chance to enter a lottery before November 15th, the winner would be the fans who would be lucky enough to buy the tickets to the Winter Classic not taken by season ticket holders. How many tickets there were in the lottery, nobody knows, but if you won the NHL would contact you. Wonderful.
If you lost, there was absolutely no communication, not one email, no date of when you would know by, nothing. A “Hey, sorry you didn’t win tickets, you may want to start looking for them elsewhere” would have been nice.
The reason nobody knows how many tickets were available is because out of the 10,000 tickets they had, the NHL has dolled out tickets to sponsors of the NHL, sponsor prospects of the NHL, media outlets, people that work at the NHL and their families. They had also given many people involved in youth hockey chances for tickets, which they had hoped would pay dividends for the future of the NHL.
Unfortunately If you look on the ticket & auction sites around the internet, you will see over 7,000 tickets for sale at any given time. The people like the people involved in sponsorship and youth hockey to whom the NHL in good faith sold tickets, only purchased the tickets to turn a profit, believe me, I know many of them. Also many season ticket holders are selling or have sold their crap tickets, for an upgrade. If you went to the Buffalo Winter Classic, you know you can’t see a thing from the nose bleed seats and will spend the whole time watching the big screen.
I’ve never been one to complain about something without offering a better idea. A forward thinking person at the NHL could rectify the Winter Classic ticket selling problem and make a small fortune for the NHL in the process.
1) Sell the tickets to Season ticket holders of both teams at a set price and make sure not to get in a problematic deal like the one with Heinz Field and their seat License holders.
2) Auctions have become and acceptable way to sell tickets, take a look at the thousand some Winter Classic tickets available on Ebay. Have an auction for the leftover seats available to the general public. The NHL says prices are set by demand, with an auction they truly are. Prices for the auction start at base seat prices and go up from there. The auction would be over the period of a month so people that have to work would not get screwed because they couldn’t call in at 10am.
Not one fan would be upset with this process, ticket prices would be set by demand and fans would know how much and how many tickets there are. On top of that, the NHL would pocket the excess. The only people upset with the process would be the ticket companies and scalpers who would be cut off at the pass.
Another thing the NHL should do is invest in it’s own ticket company, or create their own. The NHL with 23 million tickets for sale each year is tied for second behind Major League Baseball in event tickets available for purchase over the last 5 years. Ticket master adds crazy surcharges like the $13 it added to each of the $25 tickets for the Winter Classic Alumni game. Multiply $13 times 10 thousand tickets and Ticketmaster made 130 thousand on that event alone. You have to wonder if Ticketmaster is making some side deals for money also, Friday about 20 minutes after the Alumni game sold out supposedly in 4 seat per person quantities, many ticket brokers were selling the tickets with up to 20 seats together online for exorbitant prices. If 4 was the max you could get together, how do they have 20 seats together 20 minutes later?
For Pittsburgh Penguin fans who have not been able to get a ticket at or around face value, you may want to start questioning what they did with the tickets. I’m being generous when I say the Penguins have 16,000 season ticket holders, at last check the number was a bit above 14,000. The waiting list is about 4000 and those people were promised Winter Classic tickets also. That is a total of 20,000 tickets. If the NHL gave them 30,000, that is a 10,000 ticket difference or the same amount the NHL dished out. Where did those tickets go?
I agree with everything you said. I’m one of the STH with the crap seats. I was expecting much better seats since we support the team year round. I know Steeler fans that got better seat than the STH for $20 more a seat
Zoe – Apparently, the lucky Steeler season ticket holders that did get tickets probably got nicer ones than many of the Penguin season tickets holders because of one fact: The Steeler season ticket holders hold the seat license to almost every seat in Heinz Field and were told when they purchased their seat license that they would be given first crack at buying seats for every event ever held at Heinz Field. I’m guessing that they really only ever thought it would be for concerts or monster truck pulls when they made that decision 10 years ago and never thought there would be an event played by a team that had its own ticket base. The people who should be most upset are the 50,000+ Heinz Field seat license holders who were NOT given the opportunity to purchase tickets for an event they were originally told they were entitled to.
Remember the scene in Jurassic Park where the evil capitalist business archetype mentions the price of visiting the island and the good and caring scientist said that this isn’t about money and it should be open to all people, and the evil capitalist said that one day a year they could have coupon day. Having tickets sold as an auction guarantees that only the wealthiest people will get to go, no Joe Sixpack and his little boy Elroy can keep up on an auction site… what he can do is try to have his wife dial in a 10AM or enter a lottery on NHL.COM. In fact it’s rather cynical that you begrudge people in youth hockey getting tickets just to turn around and sell them at a profit because they usually sell them on an auction site… so there, you’ve got your wish. But in the existing scenario, the little guy gets to profit from an auctioned ticket and in your scenario, the inflated prices generated by an auction all goes to the NHL. It’s like you’re practically an agent for the league, rabble rousing in order to gin up sentiment that will call for an even more profitable, less egalitarian distribution of tickets to a REGULAR season game.
If the entity that is selling the tickets has a single point auction where only the end purchaser of the ticket is the purchaser of said ticket, it would cut out the middle man whether it be ticket broker or junior hockey parent turned ticket broker and for all intents and purposes would create the best price for both seller and buyer. Only someone who has profited as a middle man in such a situation or a person that doesn’t support hockey year round and feels that they are equally entitled to purchase a ticket as a person that does support hockey is against this. If you don’t mind me asking, which one of the above categories do you fall into?
Your logic is surely dizzying. Well, not really. It’s a common fallacy, it’s called “The False Alternative” which is suggesting the ONLY alternatives are A and B when clearly C exists. I’m not in either of your categories. Of course the fact that you addressed none of my points isn’t surprising. Do you agree that this method will create vastly more income for the NHL? Do you agree that in this model you guarantee that only the wealthiest patrons will succeed? Do you acknowledge that no other sports league or band or sets a ticket price in this manner? Should the Pens do this with STH’s? Why ensure from year to year that you can return to the same seat, while I’m left to buy tickets from middle men. Why have season ticket holders at all? If the object of ticket sales is the ensure the best price for producer and consumer, put all 20,000 tickets for all 41 games up for auction? Why do you consider THIS regular season game any differently from the rest? As they say, sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander.
But I’ll answer your questions as much as I can. I’ve never once sold a ticket at a profit to any sporting event or concert. I regularly purchase tickets at inflated prices because of STH’s who sell their tickets above face value. As to who is entitled to buy a ticket. You’ve become internally inconsistent. Are you saying that there should be an auction but some sort of Hockey loyalty test should be applied before one is allowed to bid? Can you define “support”?
It is eye opening; your use of the word “entitled”. That’s clearly what this is about. All the negative comments in fact. A vast sense of entitlement. I don’t blame the posters for feeling this way. Society has convinced them that they have RIGHTS to all sorts of things.
Right now only the very wealthy and the season ticket holders are able to view the game in person, having an auction of all the non season ticket holder seats at the same time through the NHL ensures that all fans would be able to purchase tickets without the middle man taking advantage of the tickets and adding a fortune to them to turn a profit.
What part of that are you confused about? What would you say is the lowest ticket price you could get seats at right now? Simple fact, if only the end use was purchasing the ticket, the price would be WAY WAY lower.
Sorry, I didn’t have to read anything past the first sentence you wrote to realize that your a part time Capitals fan who lives in Baltimore, sociology 101, you guys seriously are the best part time supporters of any team ever in the NHL’s history! Merry Christmas and good luck in the Winter Classic, please respond if your are not a Capitals fan from Baltimore.
Why exactly are Caps fans in Baltimore so horrid?
I live in the city of Baltimore, I am a CAPS STH. I have been for some time and I got screwed into the worst possible seating because I don’t have glass seats and don’t spend $20k for my 2 seats.
All in all, thats fine, I understand that the Steelers made a ridiculous promise to their licensees as have the Ravens and many other NFL teams in their quest to reap more profit. My only real gripe is allegedly Pens STHs were offered pre-paid parking, yet I don’t believe myself or any other Caps STHs were, at least not upper bowl.
Please refrain from the blanket statements about Baltimore Caps fans. I grew up playing hockey in upstate NY and southern Ontario, and live in the mid atlantic now because of work and my wife’s family; trust me everyone that knows me considers me insane for hockey. There are Hockey fans and supporters here.
Have a great New Year, and hope you enjoy the WC.
Sold my crap bleacher seats, made $150 profit, I’m going to use it watching the game in a warm bar with a bunch of friends were I’ll be able to see the game and drink for about 1/3 of what it will cost there. I won’t be able to say I was there, but I won’t feel like I was taken advantage of either.
From what I am hearing, not one Steeler season ticket got any WC tickets. The whole thing was just a ploy to placate them over the seat license deal. How do I know this? A very good friend of mine runs one of the largest ticket brokerages here in town and told me that they did not get one phone call from anyone looking to sell WC tickets they got from the Steelers. He said that just wouldn’t happen if 1500 – 2500 people got WC tickets through the Steelers. He said, “I can absolutely guarantee you someone that got them would have been looking to sell them to us”
I was at a customer’s home the other day, and he was very happy to show me his WC tickets that he was awarded as part of the Steelers season ticket holder lottery.
Why should we believe your own lyin’ eyes. Surely we should believe the pure conjecture of a ticket broker who doesn’t understand statistics. 😉
I wouldn’t have minded the upper bowl on the sideline, but the bench seats in the end zone is a slap in the face. If the Penguins got 30,000 tickets, that means that they most likely didn’t have to sit us STH’s in the end zone. I stuck with my tickets through the bad years, thank you Pens management for rewarding my support.
I am with you brother, I am a season ticket holder as well. I will be up in the bleacher seats. I am not sure it is the Penguins who relegated us STHs to peanut heaven. I understand that the NHL handled the ticket distribution. The STH seats were awarded based on the level of your tickets in the CEC. Not positive, but that is what I heard.
count me in as a shafted season ticket holder a bunch of buddies in my section are pissed also a few have tried calling the pens and complaining its usless loyalty is a two way street
I’m at the game complaining about exactly what u wrote, the guy next to me told me to read this. I agree, I agree, I agree, thank you for writing this. The NHL screwed the pooch on this one and the pooch is NHL’s best friend. GO PENS!!!!!!!
Your welcome and that guy sitting by you must be a genius.
Probably is a genius that can spell “you’re”
What I am not still in the lotto for tickets? They definitely need to do something different.
Even though it’s a regular-season game, it’s an NHL event. This is not a home game for either team. It is, first and foremost, a marketing endeavor intended to increase the NHL’s brand value.
The first rule of sports event ticketing is to take care of the VIPs. The STHs are going to come no matter what. But you expect VIPs and those who get tix via corporate partners to sit in the upper deck? That’s not how these things work. You don’t have Crosby and Ovechkin appear on The Price is Right to give away nosebleed seats.
Like all companies, the NHL has to keep its many sponsors and partners happy. It does that at events like this. Would you prefer that VIPs get first dibs on finals tickets when the Penguins fight for the Cup? I know I wouldn’t.
Though this counts as 2 points, this is more of an event than a regular season game. So we shouldn’t be surprised when ticket policies reflect that. And let’s face it, the actual proximity to the ice won’t matter for this game — those in the best seats will be watching the big screens just like those in the highest row of the stadium.
So both teams still have 41 home games? You may want to re-check your facts.
Yes, it’s an event, it is a hockey game also. Corporate people sit in super boxes, how many do you think will be sitting out in the elements? The NHL is screwing us fans. Lose the fans, lose the sponsorships, it’s that simple.
NHL fans like me are notorius for supporting our teams and sponsors of our teams. I swore I’d never do it, but this year I went and purchased Chinese made jersey’s for me and as gifts the first time. I figured if the NHL wants to screw me a ticket holder with shitty seats, I’m not paying 4 times as much for a jersey to support their sorry asses.
Nice! NHL wants new fans, but how about the ones they already have. Companies are always looking for new people and then screw the people they already have that are loyal to them. NHL fits right into that.
As a whole, hockey fans are far more loyal than fans of other major North American sports. The NHL is very aware of this. It knows it can give the STH less-than-great seats and, though they’ll grumble about it, they’ll accept it. That fan fervor gives the league the ability to cater to sponsors and VIPs who may be casual fans in an effort to grow the game.
And while that may suck in the short term, keep in mind that if the league successfully increases interest, it also will increase the value of its TV contract, which — in theory — ought to lower the percentage of league revenue from ticket sales. By a large margin, the NHL gets most of its money from ticket sales. If the interest of casual fans can be piqued, it could lessen the burden (at least from a percentage standpoint) on ticketholders.
It sounds like you are in agreement that the NHL gave STH’s crappy seats or as you call them less-than-great.
A better TV contract will most likely lower the PERCENTAGE of league revenue from ticket sales, but most of this will go towards increasing the salary cap under the NHL Collective Bargaining Agreement.
In a world filled with fountains that dish out cherry soda, the Penguins management would lower the prices. In a world were the Penguins management gives it’s loyal customers the bench seats in in the endzone on a freezing cold day I’m afraid if there is more interest in hockey, demand for tickets will go up and ticket prices will increase under the basic laws of supply and demand. All of the fans living paycheck to paycheck and taking on second jobs just so they can have season tickets and support their team will be left out in the cold once again.
What??? They are making NHL jerseys in China!!! What is this world coming to??
And where is this cherry soda fountain thing??
Surey we could have gotten better seats, but I look at it this way: The Penguins have treated me pretty damn fairly as a season ticketholder these past five years. You said the Pens gave STH’s seats ind the endzones … not so, it was the NHL. Sure, the Pens probably could have fought harder for us, but after reading through the lines of the recent Puck Daddy interview with an NBC exec about the first Winter Classic, I got the vibe that the only reason we’re hosting this game is because the Pens were willing to be the visiting team in the 1st Winter Classic, so perhaps the franchise — although it felt it was owed something by the NHL — didn’t want to push their luck too hard on this front. Really, given that NYC has not hosted a single Winter Classic game and the Pens are playing in their second WC in four years, I’m not going to complain too loudly.
Bottom line for me is that I don’t expect any good seats for an outdoor game, and if given the option, I probably would choose cheaper seats because none are going offer good sight lines. This is a spectacle, not a hockey game. If you want to spend a lot of money on good hockey, wait until April, May and June.
And no, I’m not in marketing. I’m probably the farthest thing from it, but I occasionally cross paths with marketing people. They wouldn’t use “less-than-great” to describe those seats, they’d call it “nearly premium” or “Elite Level 2” or some similar bullshit. Since I’ve sat in only Heinz’s upper deck, I’d call them “the usual.”
It is easy for the NHL to say they gave the Penguins 30,000 tickets to distribute, then when people are unhappy, the Penguins claim it was the NHL who did it. Both are to blame, the Penguins are a franchise of the NHL.
In fairness, the NHL didn’t need to give any Penguin STH tickets, but I would have loved to seen them handle that PR mishap.
Right after the ratings for a Winter Classic did not come in as high as the NHL wanted Puck Daddy stated that the NHL needed Crosby and Ovechkin in a Winter Classic to get the ratings up. The NHL doesn’t owe teams for being visitors in a WC, teams are clammoring to play whether home or visitor. Bettman needs the ratings for a TV contract. If you havent already, you can read my opinion about that here: HBO
24/7 has Capitals and Penguins Players Acting Different On the Ice
I like “nearly premium”
Isn’t there like a 5 year waiting list for Season Tickets? I suggest all the whiners who feel they got “shafted” on tickets to a 42nd game just get out of the fan game completely and cancel their season tickets. NHL Center Ice is only $180/year and the beer is cheap and the parking is even cheaper. There are lots of people who would love to take your spot; at CEC and Heinz.
I noticed you mentioned marketing endeavor then used the phrase “less-than-great” I’m guessing your in marketing.
I know people who complained about the cost of their initial seating assignment in the lower bowl this season. several changed seats to the upper bowl; now they’re complaining they weren’t able to buy good seats down low for the WC.
That said, way to justify pirating. It seems 80-percent of the jerseys owned by people I know are knockoffs. That’s a lot of revenue the NHL is missing out on, but hey, everyone wants a deal, right?
I wonder how much of our ticket prices subsidize those losses, just like honest people subsidize insurance fraud. (Of course, if people bought only authentic jerseys, they would own a lot fewer of them, but still, the league would have more revenue.)
The NHL isn’t a charity, a consumer shouldn’t be expected to pay for a more expensive product in order to support the business… the business should work to license a manufacturer that can make jerseys at a price consumers are willing to pay. You can either try to be elite and charge a premium like Sam Adams, or you can try to be cheap and sell to everyone like Coors. But you can be elite and moan about the fact that lots of people drink cheap beer.
“can’t” obviously.
Wow, you’ve made a typing error that I should ostracise yet won’t.
Which was corrected immediately. And I’m pretty sure my ‘typing error’ won’t mind being ostracized.
i taped the price is right to see crosby and he wasnt on the show he was on a tv recorded very stupid
Though there are a lot of good points from both sides on this matter, let’s not lose sight of how exciting it is to just be a part of this event. I was unhappy about sitting in the bleachers, but ultimately, I will be tickled just to be there. I went to the WC in Buffalo and sat like five rows back. As it turns out, those seats sucked….bad. I could not see the game at all. 5 rows back in a football stadium with the ice rink 50 yards away means you can’t see shit. I watched most of the game on the jumbo-tron. IT WAS AN AWESOME EXPERIENCE.
Awesome comment. Some STH’s feel an overwhelming sense of entitlement. I bet fans of every team would like an extra regular season game in their backyard that they have first rights to buy.