The more things change the more they stay the same.
It was only last off season that the rumor mill had the Pittsburgh Penguins trading full No Trade Clause (NTC) Evgeni Malkin to the Florida Panthers. This off season, we are once again treated to the circus of trade – no trade. Once again, the apparent trade is involving a Penguin with a full NTC, Patric Hornqvist being traded to the Panthers.
What the Led Zeppelin tune, ‘The Song Remains the Same”? Only the names seem to have changed a little.
Oh, one other change, this rumor, well it is pretty much confirmed, the two teams in question are apparently trying to make a deal. The only thing keeping it from being a done deal is a snag over insurance concerns and approval from one of the players involved.
Insurance concerns?
Florida, apparently, is concerned over Hornqvist’s contract not being insured in case of injury.
Player approval?
Hornqvist has to approve any trade and the team apparently hasn’t been able to reach him.
Now, I don’t have any problems trading anyone, if the trade improves the team. In fact, when Hornqvist signed his current contract, I wondered why GM Jim Rutherford gave him a full NTC (that is right it was Rutherford who gave Hornqvist the NTC, he didn’t inherit a player with it) making it tough time trading him. I, honestly, would not at all be upset to move Hornqvist, depending on conditions (including Hornqvist being amenable to the deal), because I would love to see what a Samuel Poulin, Anthony Angello, or even dark horse Nathan Legare, could do playing Hornqvist’s role of the net front presence on the Power Play (PP).
However, the Hornqvist trade, from the details leaked so far, would indicate the Penguins will lose on the deal. In a perfect situation both teams win on a trade, getting an asset they need in exchange for assets they have in abundance. Unfortunately for the Penguins, the Penguins are trading away from an area of weakness to add to an area overflowing with similar players. The Penguins already have a plethora of puck moving Defensemen that are soft on the puck and give it away with extreme regularity, they don’t need another one.
Yes, that is what Rutherford is looking to pick up, puck moving Defenseman, Mike Matheson. The same Mike Matheson who gave the puck away 135 times in 2018-2019, 135 times!
Should the trade go through, not only would the Penguins increase their number of puck moving, defensive liability Defensemen, they would also enjoy picking up another long term bad contract.
Penguins fans are you still upset about the Jack Johnson contract?
That contract only has 3 years left and although Johnson’s Cap hit will remain $3.25 million, the team will only have to pay him $3 million, $3 million, and $2.25 million. Matheson will cost the team a Cap hit of $4.875 million for 6 years. More importantly, the Penguins will have to pay the puck moving Defenseman $3.5 million this coming season, then $5 million the following season, then $4 million, then $6.5 million for 3 more seasons, and get this, this underachieving give away artist’s contract has a modified NTC clause that kicks in this coming season making a little tougher to shed him. (Yikes!)
Matheson’s contract makes Johnson’s contract look almost palatable.
Furthermore, not only is the team trading for a player that they have in abundance, they are trading from an area of weakness. Our Penguins are not blessed with much in the way of grit and willingness to go to the net, yet Rutherford appears to be willing to sacrifice what little the team has in an effort to increase the number of perimeter players.
A Josh Yohe tweet from about 6pm yesterday has given me some hope though;
“And by the way, while the Penguins and Panthers were obviously close to pulling this off, the trade might not happen at all. Clearly information got out before the teams would have liked. Sounds like things are totally stuck now. Like I said, the Penguins…never boring.”
I would really love to see what Poulin or Angello could do on the PP but not at the expense of Matheson’s contract or at the expense of Matheson’s lack of defensive acumen. I hope you are right Yohe I hope this deal doesn’t go through. I’ll take boring on this one.
Rick
Trade is final
Hornqvist to the Panthers
Matheson and Sceviour to the Pens
Everyone seems to have it absolutely backward. What this this trade says is more about Hornqvist’s value than Matheson’s. The only return for Hornqvist is going to be dreck.
Everybody wanting the Pens to get younger and faster? Exactly how are the Pens going to do that? There is no cap space so it means trading Hornqvist for anyone who fits that description. I guess Matheson and his terrible contract is the best they could. The option is doing nothing. The issue isn’t a great Hornqvist trade vs Matheson. It’s the Matheson trade vs nothing. Anyone who complains about this trade should in all fairness say that they are willing to go into next season with the team as is. Yeah, but you go right ahead hanging on to pipe dreams like Poulin, Legare and Angello will make the team much less make a difference. The trade for Matheson also makes you wonder how serious the Pens are when they express undying love for Joseph.
Personally, I think the trade is a mistake because anything they do is rearranging the Titanic’s deck chairs. This version of the Pens is going down fast. I wouldn’t sign anyone log term based on the assumption that they will be starting over in 2-3 years and don’t want any deadwood to clear out.
Hey Stratton,
Mike sort of mentioned the same thing below about Hornqvist’s perceived value and to add weight to your thought, one of the sticking points is insurance should Hornqvist get injured. That is why many of eyebrow were raised when JR gave Hornqvist the contract initially.
I do like your analogy about rearranging the Titanic’s deck chairs.
I also agree about not signing anyone long term and that is why I dislike this trade. Hornqvist’s contract clears in 3 yrs but Matheson’s is 6 yrs with the heaviest toll in real money $6.5 million being the last 3 years. It will be tough to rebuild 3 years from now when $6.5 million is being shelled out in real money.
Finally, I hadn’t thought about it but you are right, this trade would seem to cast some doubt on Joseph
Just a few random thoughts.
I’ve read quite a few Panthers blogs, and everyone…and I mean everyone…was overjoyed at the thought of shedding Matheson and his contract. The negative reviews of this kid were just off the charts.
I can’t begin to fathom why Rutherford would want to take on such an onerous (and back-loaded) contract to acquire a player that everyone regards as talented but broken.
And we thought guys like Scuderi and Johnson were/are tough to unload. As you so aptly noted, Stratton, we’d be manacled to a pricey salary precisely around the time the bottom drops out on the Pens.
Can’t imagine such a move would’ve sat too well with Burkle and Lemieux, either (I’ve heard Burkle’s equity has taken a hit through the covid situation). I’ve got to think this attempted deal made them sit up and take notice…and perhaps question whether Rutherford possesses the ability to manage this rebuild. Given the constraints we’re facing, it’s going to require nerves of steel and letter-perfect precision. Perhaps too much to ask of anyone, let alone a 71-year-old whose best days (and deals) may be behind him.
On the flip side, I’m sure JR had to consult with others within the organization before pursuing this trade, including new defensive coach Todd Reirden. Maybe Reirden told JR that Matheson was fixable. Dunno.
Still…an enormous gamble. One I really don’t think the Pens can afford to make at this stage.
Rick
Rick
Check my comment below – I think JR is somewhat handcuffed right
now with Hornqvist – The Pen’s know his better days are behind him
and are desperately trying to trade him – the problem is there aren’t
many takers.
if he waits another year he probably won’t have any interest. I love
Hornqvist and we need a player with his grit/toughness & determination but he does need to go. Letang shoudn’t be far behind.
The Other Rick
My guess even if the trade is nullified Hornqvist will be moved – this is much
like the Kessel to Minny trade. You’ve already made it clear to the player he’s
not in your plans going forward – tough to bring a player back under those
circumstances. Just saying.
Hey Mike,
In this case, as much as I like Hornqvist, I am very comfortable with moving on, as long as we don’t replace his spot with a Dominik Simon up-front. If the team moves on from Hornqvist, the void among the forwards needs to be filled by someone willing to go to the net, a player willing to do the dirty work. The team has way too many perimeter, primadonna players, they don’t need more.
Hey Mike,
Just saw from Kingarski that this version of the deal may be off. He went on to say that some version of a deal may be resurrected, but the current version may be dead.
On another interesting side bar to this story, Kingarski also wrote “Rumors were flying, even inside the Penguins organization and among the players, on Wednesday afternoon. It is a fair statement; the Penguins locker room would be incredibly disappointed to lose Patric Hornqvist, perhaps even more so than they were to lose Carl Hagelin in November 2018.”
(I wonder which players to which they were referring)
That sounds like the team is going to have to sell the players on the idea of life without Hornqvist.
Again, as a fan of the Pens, I get it, if JR could better the team and Hornqvist agrees to it, great. Just make sure Hornqvist is replaced with a player with sand in his game.
The Other Rick
Kingarski also said he wouldn’t trust any of the info being released because neither the Pen’s or Panthers have commented on the trade.
He seemed a little upset that they took the info that had been received by
media sources and ran with it and they’ll never do that again.
Who knows what’s really going on right now?
The Other Rick
It sounds like to me the deal will get done today. Rutherford has also indicated
once its completed he plans to trade one of our LD’s. My guess is Pettersson.
Judging by comments I read last night trading Hornqvist has not been an easy
task and we have a better chance of seeing Angello & Poulin if the trade goes
thru.
I’m a Horny fan – love his game but it’s declining – his body is one big bruise.
Hopefully there are other moves planned to replace what he gave us on the
ice. Keeping my fingers crossed.
I hear you Mike
I really like what Horny has done for the team and I agree he hasn’t been the same for awhile. I thought Angello should already have been given a tryout on the PP during one of 72s absences this past season. Even if Angello would have failed, the team would have known one way or another about the player.
Also, I would love to move on from Pettersson. If he had been given a $2.5 – $3 mil extension I wouldn’t have problems with the Big Swede, but at $4 mil – no.
Viewed from what you are saying (Pettersson out too), Matheson’s contract, from a Cap hit perspective isn’t as bad down the road, since Pettersson is $4.025,125 for the next 5 years, it will only be about $800k difference.
Unfortunately from a real money perspective, Matheson will hit the team for $6 mil those final 3 seasons.
I can understand it if, as you say, it was hard to find a trading partner for Hornqvist, I, too, am a fan of the guy. I wish the team had at least 5 other forwards with his grit and commitment to play and I would never have begrudged him the money of his current contract, I just didn’t want the Pens to be the team paying it.
However, I am still skeptical of this deal, unless there are other parts to it that we are not seeing – a draft pick, unloading Simon’s rights so Sully can’t put him on the ice, or Johnson’s contract, (or Pettersson’s contract down the road).
Straight-up, from the leaked details we are seeing, I don’t see the team winning this deal. If it goes through, somebody is going to have to teach Matheson how to hold on to the puck. If that can be done, maybe he can grow into his contract. Schultz wasn’t as bad as this kid when we got him from Edm but he was pretty bad and did turn his game around until he got hurt. I hope Matheson can do the same if he dons the Black and Gold.
Just throwing this out there, if, as the scouting reports say, Matheson, with his shot is a good fit for the PP as the QB, does that mean Letang’s $7 mil may be out the door as well?
The Other Rick
I know Matheson had 135 giveaway’s in 2018-19 but if he would of
played a full 81 game schedule this year he would of cut the
stat in half “sounds like improvement”
I do think JR is somewhat handcuffed trying to move Hornqvist – right
now he’s reduced to a 3rd or 4th line player making 5.3mil per year. If
you wait another year to move him it could really be disastrous.
Its very similar to Kessel – I’m always preaching that its important for a
team to know their players and when it’s time to move them. Not sure
if you saw this but Arizona is already trying to move Kessel.
I think that time has come for both Hornqvist and Letang.